AU 2008 Sessions

The selection of the next Revit classes to attend at Autodesk University 2008 is well under way. A recent post by David Baldacchino (Do U Revit?) pointed this out already and you can visit the BLAUG blog too. If you haven't voted already you can take a look at the list and see. Once you've voted you can't get back in to look over the list, or at least I couldn't.

I received an email asking why my name was not among the submissions. Simple, I didn't submit anything this year.

Last year I felt that I was unable to participate as much as I would have liked to, in my role as a board member with Autodesk User Group International (AUGI). This year I'm not going to have that conflict. Plus I hope to actually attend more classes this year!

Besides, there are so many more very capable users now, compared with a few years ago, that I doubt my absence will be noticeable. There are a great many classes to choose from and I wish the AU planning team all the best trying to pick from them. Hopefully the polling will help too!!

See you at AU 2008!

Off Topic - Amputee Has Advantage

Not the slightest bit about Revit...

This evening I read an article in USA Today about Oscar Pistorius, a 21 year old track athlete from South Africa who wants to compete at the Olympics in Beijing. He just happens to be lacking his lower legs and uses either prosthetic legs or blades to get around.

Briefly, a ruling was made that says that he has an unfair advantage over able-bodied runners when using his "blades" and therefore cannot compete. His lawyers are about to challenge that ruling in an upcoming court case.

This struck me as odd...first he's missing his bloody lower legs!!! Is that really an advantage if he uses the prosthetic blades? The scientist who determined that he has an advantage has tried this out for himself?? I suggest that the folks making the decision try it out for awhile and see what kind of real advantage he has. No matter how good they fit I can't imagine it is better than a real knee and lower leg for smooth and proper "operation". Second, if he wins his case and gets to compete and does so to a victory...I can't help but wonder if this means that other able-bodied runners will now have their legs cut off just so they have a similar advantage???

I suspect his real advantage will be a strong spirit and uncommon determination to be a successful track athlete despite his difference. I say bravo...and good luck!

Sorry to wander off the Revit focus I have usually...but I know some Revit users who live in South Africa AND I've mentioned Revit a couple times in the post too!!

Insert from File

This feature is intended to allow us to acquire information from another project file and add it to our current project. There are two methods, Views and 2D Elements. Both methods involve selecting a project file first. To get started you choose the File menu and then Insert from File.

The first option, Views, grants us access to views and sheets. The catch is the views are 2D views like drafting, detail and schedule views as well as sheets. The sheets must either be empty or contain only 2D views. In the past I posted an article describing using this to deal with dummy sheets to fill out a complete drawing list. This feature presents us with a dialog listing the eligible views.


It is a great way to transfer office standard detail sheets and schedules into a new project. When you select a sheet that includes just 2D views Revit will bring the sheet and all the views on it into your project as well as placing them on the sheet.

For campus projects that share details it allows you to place copies of the details in each building file so you can create intelligent view references to the details. If you only change them in the "master" file (a primary building model project) you only need to keep the sheet and detail numbers coordinated if you do all printing from the "master" project file.

The second option, 2D Elements is intended let us "steal" drafting annotation, detail lines and detail components from model views. Imagine a wall section that is the same or very similar to the one you are working on now. Using this tool you can grab the 2D embellishment in the other project and added it to your current model's view. This tool presents a dialog of eligible views too, all views that have any 2D information added to them.


Annotation that requires a reference like dimensions or tags will likely fail to insert for fairly obvious reasons, namely the reference isn't necessarily in the same location or even present.

Revit 2009 Versions Released

As of 3pm today Autodesk officially released and announced that the new versions were available for download. Some were able to download it a bit earlier than intended by "reverse engineering" the web address for 2008 versions. While it technically worked I refrained because I wanted to hear it from the "horse's mouth" that it was released, on the off chance that a final build hadn't been posted yet.

So the good news is that for those with adequate broadband access you can download the version you use anytime you want now.

Here are the links to each version:

Revit Architecture 2009


Revit Structure 2009


Revit MEP 2009


Note: Only the English version is available for download at this time as they are preparing the other language version now.

Also take care to download the correct version if you own the "suite" that includes AutoCAD or AutoCAD MEP. As Greg noted in his blog this morning you won't be able to authorize AutoCAD properly because the "suite" version is not posted at the Autodesk site for download.

Revit MEP Air Terminal - Troubleshooting

I received an email from client asking for a little assistance with an air terminal family. Apparently the diagonal line they wanted to indicate that the terminal is a "return" wouldn't play along when the family changed size.

Recently I was in Houston and David Baldacchino (Do U Revit? blog) and I had a chance to hang out. He told me about a new (new to me) video capture tool called Jing Project by Techsmith (makers of my favorite screen capture tool SnagIT) that allows you to do screen capture to video or images as well as audio. Then you can easily post the video on Screencast. This post is as much a test as an example of troubleshooting a family.

The issue came down to this. Revit constrains elements orthogonally. The diagonal symbolic line is constrained to the reference planes, not the edges of the neck opening that they wanted it to "follow". The video describes the process of using the Automatic Sketch Dimensions (ASD's) that Revit applies when we do not explicitly add our own dimensions or lock padlocks, for example. The ASD's will do the job nicely as long as well "tell" them what is important to us.

Here's a link to the video: (embedded it is too big to view on the blogger screen)

Download it HERE. (3.75mb)

CAD Surveys and your Revit Project

This text was posted at AUGI by David Conant (Autodesk Revit Product Designer) in February this year. It is very important information.

This method should ALWAYS be followed. It is critical to follow when the survey coordinates of your building site have large values (> 2 miles/3km from site 0,0):

ALWAYS locate sites underneath buildings. Revit buildings like to stay near home and be oriented to project north. Sites can wander about and talk to the buildings later. DON'T try to pan your view 40 km northeast of 0,0 and try to build your building model there because your site coordinates have a remote origin. This will work in AutoCAD but in Revit you will be very unhappy.

NEVER import or link a site with large coordinate values Origin to Origin! This may seem correct based on AutoCAD experience, but here too you will be very unhappy in Revit. You will get the correct origin later in the process.

• Build your revit model at or near the position of the elevation marks in the default template with the building oriented orthagonal to your desired printing frame. i.e. use a Project North not True North for your working environment.

For one building on a site:

• Link in a site model or site dwg.
• Move and Rotate the SITE so that it is located correctly relative to the building.
• Acquire the site's coordinates. Now, the site's origin will be the origin of your shared coordinates. The site's Y axis will be True North. The site coordinate values can be arbitrarily large without disturbing Revit's internal calculations.
• You can later open the site model and link in the building using shared location and it will land in the exact position.

For multiple buildings on a site:

• Create a Site project, link in a site dwg, placing the center of the building site near the center of the default view.
• Acquire coordinates from the site.
• Build any site elements, topos, etc.
• Link in building rvts. Move and rotate them so that they are correctly located on the site.
• Publish coordinates to the rvts. Now all models will have the same Shared origin and True North orientations.
• You can now link the site into any of the buildings (the other buildings can be linked in as well) using shared location and it will be in the exact location.

Hostile Takeover - Google takes on Autodesk AND Bentley

Latherdon - 2008

In a surprise move, some say shocking, this morning Google announced its intent to take over Autodesk AND Bentley. Analysts say this is a strategic acquisition to take control of the "Information" in Building Information Modeling (BIM). No details were provided regarding how the combination of two major rivals for the computer aided design marketplace would be managed. Nor did the announcement discuss the likely lawsuit, from other cad vendors like Solid Works, ArchiCAD to name just two, claiming anti-trust violations. Google management stated that they intend to offer $12.50 per share for Autodesk shares and $6.50 per share for Bentley though Bentley remains a privately held company. Based on current market value this places the entire deal in the $2 gazillion range.

Attempts to reach competing software vendors for comment were not possible before releasing this news.

About the Author: Freddy Latherdon
Freddy has been on hiatus since undergoing knee surgery after a unexplained billards accident. He returned to work just in time to capture the essence of what will turn out the be the biggest BIM story yet, assuming the deal goes through.

Yes...this is nonsense...please don't panic...!!!

In separate announcement Google introduced its latest feature for Gmail, Custom Time. Now you can never be late with your response, you could even be early, earlier than the request in the first place!

Tale of a Round Trip - Revit MEP Family and RAC

Attended a local user group recently and an attendee asked if it was possible, and/or useful, to use a Revit MEP (RME) family in a Revit Architecture (RAC) model, for example a toilet. The answer given was yes, but we would lose plumbing engineering functionality of the toilet while working with it in RAC.

First the greatest advantage to using a RME toilet in a RAC project is if the RME team is going to actually work on the same project file. While this is certainly possible it might not be very likely for at least two reasons, separate firms doing the work and model/Revit performance (based on project size).

A second possible advantage is that RME users can Copy/Paste elements in a linked RAC file into their project. If it is already a RME toilet, using the same example, then it is now ready for pipe. The RAC user can decide if they want to keep their toilet or let the RME version stand in now, much like Revit Structure (RST) columns ultimately replace the ones the RAC user placed originally.

It was suggested that Revit might change the family if it was used in RAC and then returned to RME. I didn't think that would be the case so tonight, just for grins, I did two different tests:

1 - RME Toilet round trip between RME and RAC in the project environment to see if Revit did anything unkind to the family. Answer - no!

2 - RME Toilet round trip between RME and RAC in the family editor environment to see if Revit did anything unkind to the family. Answer - no!

The primary difference in both cases was that most of the RME specific features were visible but inaccessible to the RAC user. Here's the dialog box captures for each sequence, starting with the project environment.

RAC Project - Properties

RME Project - Properties

RAC Family Editor - Connector Properties

RAC Family Editor - Family Types

RME Family Editor - Connector Properties

RME Family Editor - Family Types

You can see that the family survived being opened and saved in both RAC and RME without harming the usability of the family in either version. In fact in RAC a few of the parameters, like Flow Pressure is still editable, while other engineering criteria are simply inaccessible.

So the question remains, what benefit is there to use RME families in RAC if you are not working within the same project file? Well apart from the Copy/Paste tool letting your RME consultant use your fixtures, I suppose not much!

Well that was fun!

Revit MEP - Family Connector - Arrow Direction

When you create a Revit MEP family that requires a connector (most will) you need to pay attention to the direction of the arrow that appears on the connector. In the following image the arrow points down, out of a water closet fitting.

Yes the arrow is also different than the Flow Direction parameter in the properties of the connector.


If it were to point up then Revit would think that a pipe should connect from within the bowl of the water closet (toilet)...which would be wrong. You'd also likely get a message like this one.

This is trying to tell you that Revit just couldn't figure out how to get your fixture connected to the pipe you selected. Usually this message is related to the elevation of the pipe and the fixture or they are too close together for specified fittings to actually connect properly. When it comes to the pictured connector it means that the pipe is running the opposite direction AND that the elevation I used for the related pipe is too close to the same elevation.

Yes, you'll have to put on your detective hat, light your pipe and seek out the "elementary" explanation my "Dear Watson".

If you are curious the water closet fitting pictured above is part of a "rough-in" connector for a floor mounted toilet. The issue at present is that the basic plumbing fixtures that the architect uses in Revit Architecture has no connectors and that even if it did when their model is linked into RMEP they wouldn't be usable to connect pipe. Thus the notion of just the rough-in components instead of putting another toilet in the same place.

Turns out what we thought was "clever" is what Autodesk's RMEP team was thinking too and you'll find some basic connector families in the content with the release of Revit MEP 2009. Here's a screen capture of the mockup example.

Release Date Released - April 15th, 2008

A couple of resellers have announced the expected ship date for Revit 2009 software and it is April 15th, 2008. An auspicious date...tax day! I trust there isn't nearly the sense of foreboding associated with that however!

Thanks to Greg Arkin with Cadd Centers of Florida, Revit 3D blog, and Dwane Lindsey with MasterGraphics of the Revit Arch Center blog for announcing it.

Dept. of Subtle - Beam Joins RAC 2009

In past releases when Revit Structure touted the ability to miter steel beams and Revit Architecture couldn't lots of Architecture users were mighty annoyed. Revit Structure 2009 has enhanced the join process and options AND Revit Architecture get them TOO! The Beam Join tool will be found on the "Tools" Tool Bar next door to the Edit Wall Joins button.

Here's what some beams look like after playing with them.



Since the video doesn't seem to be working in this post you can see it HERE

Proposal - Camera View Annotation

When a Camera view is created there is no built-in intentional way to show our readers where the camera is located. With Revit (and 3D design in general) more and more camera views are used to explain/document our work.

I believe there should be something like we have for sections,elevations & call-outs. and I know I'm not alone. Camera views should have annotation generated in the same way that other views in Revit do. They should appear in plan views in my opinion but an argument could be made for them showing up in elevation and section views too.

In the meantime we CAN continue to create an Annotation Symbol family that we can place and then enter detail and sheet location information...yeah, "old school"...

It could be sooo much better...

Shared Parameter File - A Little Clarification

Over the last few years I've posted several times about shared parameters (SP) so I thought I'd add this bit too. The context of this concerns the protection and/or management of the office SP file.

The SP file does NOT have an active relationship with your families or projects so there is no risk to your existing families or project(s) if someone gets cranky with your SP file and deletes it. Obviously making new stuff will be a bit harder but it is possible to recover them from existing family and project files. I've provided several links later in this post to other SP posts.

The SP file is used by Revit like a "dictionary", a place to store definitions/meaning. Revit uses it to define a parameter when it is applied to a Family and/or Project. Thereafter when Revit encounters it in the project it knows what it means. Thus NO active connection to the parameter in the file or the file itself.

What IS important is that your users are not creating shared parameters for the same things without communicating with each other. Why? Here is an example:

I create a parameter called "undercut" and you create one called "UNDERCUT" and someone else creates yet another called "Undercut". If we each create these in our own SP file and apply them to tags, projects and schedules we are fine as long as nobody else tries to use the content we made that use them.

As soon as we attempt to share things we will find that your undercut is different from ours because each shared parameter gets a unique GUID (global unique ID) number applied by Revit. So the name isn't the really important part to Revit. The name is important to us because it is what we see and besides we don't read numbers like those very well.

A little trivia, for most people more than four digits or things are difficult if not impossible to count without deliberately doing so. Four **** are easy to "count" at a glance but ***** is a bit harder at a glance. I picked that up from a book called Perfect Figures.

Here's what a typical Shared Parameter file looks like(with 3 parameters):

# This is a Revit shared parameter file.
# Do not edit manually.
*GROUP ID NAME
GROUP 1 Steel
GROUP 2 Exported Parameters
GROUP 3 Projects
*PARAM GUID NAME DATATYPE DATACATEGORY GROUP VISIBLE
PARAM 29321d2c-b02c-49c1-ab8b-c41c18fcac00 Building Letter TEXT 3 1
PARAM c17fad8a-7479-4572-9f62-8da94b702446 Weight NUMBER 1 1
PARAM 0d7b92f5-b62e-49f5-9167-263cebac962b OLF NUMBER 2 1

The portion in red is the GUID.

The best strategy is to make everyone well aware that Shared Parameters are to be managed and by whom. If they are created from a copy of the office SP file it is possible to export the parameter to the original so it isn't completely unacceptable to let people make them on their own. It IS unacceptable to do so without properly communicating it to the person in charge of them and their team(s).

That said, placing the office standard as a read only file will allow people to use them without being able to add them. They will need to get them added by the responsible party and that person better be ready to "jump" because this stuff always gets figured out at the last minute.

Finally, if someone loses the SP file it is possible to export shared parameters from projects that have them into a another or new SP file.

Here's links to the previous Shared Parameter posts:
What are Parameters and Why Should I Care?
Sharing Parameters Overview (Part 1)
Walking on Thin Ice
Making a Shared Parameter File (Part 2)
Shared Parameters Part 3
Shared Parameters Part 4
Ignore Good Advice
Home for Unwanted Doors

Dept. of Subtle - Model Text and Add Parameter Crash Revit

While looking at a problem described in a thread at AUGI I stumbled upon a very subtle awkward crash which I've submitted to Autodesk naturally.

To get in trouble you need to be using the Model Text feature and attempting to create a parameter to manage the height of the text.

The steps are:
I started in the Generic Model.rft Family Template
Add Model Text
Select the Model Text
Click Properties button to see the Instance Properties
Click Edit/New to see the Type Properties
Click Associate Family Parameter button (little gray square button, see image)
Click Add Parameter where the only available option is (None)(see image)


Nice friendly message appears (see image)


Work-around Note: if a valid parameter exists, and appears in the dialog, already you can select it instead and Revit won't crash. Revit only crashes if there is no parameter already and you need to click Add Parameter to create one on the fly.

Fwiw, it doesn't crash the upcoming release...

Is Revit like your Spouse?

I recently had someone share a funny Revit story with me. This un-named person (to protect the guilty) was expressing frustration with Revit, the learning curve and getting used to it. He showed an error message that Revit displayed, all that was displayed was a question mark "?".

No explanation, nothing, just the question mark...to which he exclaimed, "See!! Revit is just like my wife! Revit is mad at me and it won't tell me why!! It's as if Revit is saying, "If you don't know why I'm mad then I WON'T TELL YOU!!"

I realize that this isn't very "politically correct" but the shoe could easily be on the "other foot"!

Structure - Travelogue

I try not to dabble or indulge my personal stuff on this blog too much, apart from Revit being my personal thing, but I was wandering around downtown Billings, Montana (Big Sky Country) the last couple of evenings and passed this structure a couple times. The second time by, tonight, I felt compelled to snap a couple of "pitchurs".


This structure is known as Sky Point and I was pleasantly surprised to find it on Wikipedia. My client informed me of the name so that certainly helped my Google search effort! The structure has a couple of "leaves" that can swing out to fully cover the street intersection. It is in its compact state in the "pitchurs"...


So whose going to model it in Revit Structure for "fun"?

Fun facts:
Tallest column: 73 Feet
2 Shortest columns: 28 Feet
Sails: 3
Completed: April 2002
Dedicated: May 2002

One more for the road...

Dept. of Subtle - Options Bar and Tab Key

Hi again, another video attempt at a post.

We need to pay close attention to the "focus" of Revit when we enter a value on the Options Bar. In the video example I show a roof in the sketch process and I want to use the Offset parameter to create the roof edge 2'-0" from the exterior wall. When I enter the value and then try to use the Tab key to "Select the Chain of Walls or Lines" Revit doesn't acknowledge the walls. It just moves the "focus" between the Offset parameter and the Extend to Wall Core options. When I click in the Drawing Window the focus moves away from the Options Bar and the TAB key feature will work.

This is just a subtle thing that can be frustrating if you don't notice what it happening on the Options Bar. I hope the video helps too!

Shape Handle - Increase the Length of a Wall

When you want to increase the length of one end of a wall not change the other end you can use the wall's Shape Handle. To access it you need to hover over the endcap of the wall and use the TAB key, select the Shape Handle as it is called. Now you can just use the Move tool to define a distance. It is quite easy. I'm trying a video out that I made very low tech. Experimenting with the approach...

Converting Lines - Model to Detail or Vice Versa

Finally remembered to add this tip/post at AUGI from January 14, 2008, a method for changing model lines to detail lines and vice versa.

Model Lines to Detail Lines (use sketch based detail element)
- Select Model Lines and Cut to Clipboard (CTRL + X)
- Start a new Filled Region and paste the lines in anywhere
- Select the lines and cut to clipboard again
- Cancel making the Filled Region
- Paste into view - they are now Detail Lines

Detail Lines to Model Lines (use a sketch based model element)
- Select Detail Lines and Cut to Clipboard (CTRL + X)
- Start a new Floor and paste the lines in anywhere
- Select the lines and cut to clipboard again
- Cancel making the floor
- Paste into view - they are now Model Lines

I'd been using the Roof by Footprint do this for awhile but the floor is "quicker" since you don't have to choose the roof method first 8-). Technically you could just edit an existing floor or filled region and paste and cut and quit sketch to accomplish the same thing.

2009 Features - Dept. of Subtle - Currency and Commas

Another, "Finally!!" moment is nearly upon us. We have been VERY patiently waiting to be able to put currency symbols on our schedule values and the 2009 release will provide it! Along with this we will finally get to place commas in our numbers when they get into the thousands. Subtle, little...yes, but it is about time!! Welcome the little stuff!!